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Ir (Helen)
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 609
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 Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 6:33 am Post subject: Falwell says "Gay Tinky Winky is bad for Children" |
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This one has been around a while, but anyway - another of Falwell's strange opinions:
Gay Tinky Winky bad for Children |
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TXatheist
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 1150
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 7:05 am Post subject: |
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| I think Falwell is bad for xianity:) I really do. I can't imagine what it's like to be gay but I have stood up for gays. I had a gay roommate, saw brokeback mountain and fired back when emails about gays that were negative came in my inbox. We dont' understand homosexuality as far as why it happens. We have good ideas why but bashing them is not going to get them to stop being gay. IMO, there is no such thing as hating the sin and not the sinner. A murderer commits sin but a homosexual doesn't imo. One violates another, one is consensual sex. |
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Julie Marie
Joined: 27 Mar 2006
Posts: 867
Location: Mt. Pleasant, SC
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 7:19 am Post subject: |
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| there was a big flap down here in SC when a candidate for state office stated that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to teach our children. i have no way of knowing if he actually believes that, but this kind of pandering is encouraged by the folks who get uptight about a cartoon character. Teletubbies were popular way before I had kids, so I didn't have the opportunity to view for myself (and I'm not singing the blues on that one) but I am fairly certain it was just a kids show. no sexualized content. and the same for teachers - when I was a student, I was so ego-centric I didn't even think of my teachers lives outside the classroom. the thought of their intimate lives never made it into my conciousness. I imagine it is the same for todays kids. (at least I hope so. I know my son thinks his day care teachers live at the school) So who actually has the sexual hangups, after all? |
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Keith
Joined: 04 May 2006
Posts: 187
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 8:35 am Post subject: |
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TX,
Couldn't agree more that "bashing them is not going to get them to stop being gay." Never understood that theory anyway. You said that in your opinion you believe "there is no such thing as hating the sin and loving the sinner." That worn-out saying is often used to justify behavior that definitely qualifies as hating the sinner. If we lay these abuses aside for the sake of discussion, is it possible in your opinion to hate/dislike what someone does, and yet still love/like that person? You're right that Falwell has not done the one he calls Lord any favors ... how much do comments like that bother you? Does it offend you, scare you that others listen to him, or primarily reinforce your thoughts that Christians are inbred rednecks who overanalyze PBS kids programming  ? Thanks. |
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TXatheist
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 1150
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 8:53 am Post subject: |
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Keith,
The title xian does not indicate inbred redneck. If someone says they are a liberal xian in Texas I generally see that as something positive. I can't say evangelical does a whole lot for me either though in being honest. I dont' think people "need" to hear about jesus is why. Fundamenatalist is really bad though. I definitely try to decipher the act from the person but my big distinction is violating someone else versus condemning two consenting adults. If someone murders someone we both agree that's bad. If two people believe in burning the US flag in front of veterans like myself then they aren't hurting me in the slightest. Falwell says to me that there are people willing to listen to his nonsense and still keep listening. It's like the KKK. There are people who support them though it's a small number. I don't think Falwell/Dobson only has a few thousand supporters. The willingness to keep following him after he says something that stupid is what bothers me. His supporters are not dwindling fast enough. |
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Keith
Joined: 04 May 2006
Posts: 187
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks, TX |
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Karen
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 847
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 11:23 am Post subject: |
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| Keith wrote: | | If we lay these abuses aside for the sake of discussion, is it possible in your opinion to hate/dislike what someone does, and yet still love/like that person? |
There's an underlying question there: Is being homosexual something one does, or something one is?
In other words, I'm a heterosexual whether or not I'm actually having sex with men. My sexual orientation is an essential part of who I am, and affects a lot of areas of my life beyond just mere sexual behavior.
I think a lot of conservatives believe that it's okay to be gay as long as gay people don't commit same-sex acts. But is it possible to be utterly chaste, and not have your sexual orientation affect other areas in your life? If sexuality is determined or influenced by biology and genetics (as studies are increasingly showing), how can it not be more deep-seated than just a "choice" one makes about a sexual partner?
| Quote: | | You're right that Falwell has not done the one he calls Lord any favors ... how much do comments like that bother you? Does it offend you, scare you that others listen to him, or primarily reinforce your thoughts that Christians are inbred rednecks who overanalyze PBS kids programming ? Thanks. |
What scares me about Falwell is that even though he is marginalizing himself by his outrageous honesty, he's still a very, very powerful figure in a constituency that has a big influence on our politics. His universities, his TV show(s) and his legal teams all have large followings. Whether that following is mostly "inbred rednecks" - I'll decline to comment.  |
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Keith
Joined: 04 May 2006
Posts: 187
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 11:47 am Post subject: |
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Karen,
"There's an underlying question there: Is being homosexual something one does, or something one is? "
Thanks for your wise response. Yours is a question that "hate the sin, love the sinner" fails to take into account. How can we separate who we are and what we do?
Falwell's (and Robertson's) following has been a mystery to me. I wonder if their influence is overrated, but that may be wishful thinking rather than insight. |
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JaysonB
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 296
Location: Detroit, MI
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Keith wrote: | Karen,
"There's an underlying question there: Is being homosexual something one does, or something one is? "
Thanks for your wise response. Yours is a question that "hate the sin, love the sinner" fails to take into account. How can we separate who we are and what we do? |
We can't, which is why we shouldn't judge others in such a fashion when it comes to actions that harm noone and are done in their own privacy.
Her point wasn't to seperate the two, her point was that we need to seperate what we consider conscious actions and what we consider innate actions.
What one does: plays soccer.
Who someone is: a homosexual.
| Quote: |
Falwell's (and Robertson's) following has been a mystery to me. I wonder if their influence is overrated, but that may be wishful thinking rather than insight. |
it's not that much of a mystery really. Zealots have a very specific path they follow: they don't start off nuts, they build up to it. Each year they'll push the edge of being a complete nutbag, just *enough* where people can accept the change in ideology over time, and then they'll say something else even more radical.
which is why we end up with people with this fairytale notion that the world is going to end soon and we're going to have armageddon or that committing suicide will give them 72 virgins even though, personally, I'd rather have 1 woman with experience rather than 72 who don't have a clue. |
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Keith
Joined: 04 May 2006
Posts: 187
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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JaysonB,
My question, "How can we separate who we are and what we do?" was intended to be rhetorical negative (answer being: we cannot). I agree that Karen's point was not to separate the two ... neither was that my point ... please forgive my lack of clarity. Thanks. |
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Eliza
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 800
Location: Seattle WA
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 2:14 pm Post subject: |
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Tinky Winky isn't the one corrupting our kids - Laa Laa is the one to watch out for!!
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Ir (Helen)
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 609
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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Pray enlighten us, Eliza - how is Laa Laa corrupting our kids?  |
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Karen
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 847
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Keith wrote: | JaysonB,
My question, "How can we separate who we are and what we do?" was intended to be rhetorical negative (answer being: we cannot). I agree that Karen's point was not to separate the two ... neither was that my point ... please forgive my lack of clarity. Thanks. |
I got it, Keith. 
Here's the really strange thing: Wasn't it Jesus himself who said that you cannot separate who you are and what you do? I mean, what was the whole "if you lust after a woman in your heart" thing about otherwise? He removed the distinction between thought and action (rightly or wrongly - I don't happen to agree with that teaching myself).
So the whole "love the sinner, hate the sin" - besides behind extremely offensive in the first place - doesn't even make sense from a Christian theological standpoint! Weird ... |
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Ir (Helen)
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 609
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Karen wrote: | | Here's the really strange thing: Wasn't it Jesus himself who said that you cannot separate who you are and what you do? I mean, what was the whole "if you lust after a woman in your heart" thing about otherwise? He removed the distinction between thought and action (rightly or wrongly - I don't happen to agree with that teaching myself). |
I always thought Jesus said that to point out that actions begin with thoughts and so thoughts matter.
To some extent, we can change our thoughts and we can change our behavior, so - are those really who we are? |
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Eliza
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 800
Location: Seattle WA
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Pray enlighten us, Eliza - how is Laa Laa corrupting our kids? |
Didn't you know? Laa Laa is a (*gasp*, change to strident tone) secular humanist!
(Sorry for that aside - couldn't resist!) |
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